By Oliver Saenz
As a storyboard artist, as a wrestling promoter and owner, and most recently as a member of cinema, Gary Yap continues to leave his mark on the world. From Emmy-nominated work on The Simpsons and King of the Hill to the still-controversial subject that is EPIC Pro Wrestling, Gary Yap sat down for a personal interview that soon turned extremely candid…but extremely insightful and especially heart-felt. My name’s Oliver Saenz, I go by the handle of PdW2kX, and I’m delighted to bring you the exclusive and hopefully long-awaited interview with Gary Yap, including a huge announcement that will likely bring some flare back to SoCal. Part 3
Section 4
Setting the Agenda Straight Before Blowing It All Away: Gary Lets Loose and Announces EPIC Pro Wrestling WAR!
What was it like working with wrestlers as diverse as the SoCal scene itself?
So many of the boys were professional and a pleasure to be around, but a few stand out as either really making the experience great or truly being nothing but a pain in the ass.
In that case, who was fun to work with?
Super Dragon, Jack Evans, Trent Acid, El Generico, Davey Richards, Kevin Steen, Teddy Hart, Tony Kozina, Aries, Markus, Biggie … I could go on.
Who was a chore to work with?
Altar Boy Luke, who I guess calls himself Luke Hawx nowadays. I stated before that he was one of the lows of WAR. Please allow me to elaborate. I’ve never seen someone whine so much and complain about “not looking strong” as much as I saw it from Luke, and I’ve worked with Bo Cooper, so that’s saying something. HA! I kid, Bo. Kinda.
[Editor’s Note: If Bo Cooper comes after Gary Yap for these remarks, somebody remind him that Gary typed that up by himself. I want no part in what will probably become a colossal beatdown. I love Bo Cooper, anyway. Big men represent.]
Anyway, he bitched about his match, not being able to get his spots in because of his opponent, his pay, and the fact that he felt he was made to look bad in front of his boss, who was in the crowd at the time.
Interesting. Care to elaborate further?
The match (at the 10.21.05 WAR show) was scheduled to be he and Lil’ Cholo vs. Joey Ryan and Scott Lost. Anthony had booked him because he was told that Luke had lost everything in the Hurricane Katrina tragedy. I guess they had been going back and forth via MySpace and Anthony was trying to help him out, which was really nice of him to do. Let me just say ahead of time that, until that show, I had never met Luke. I had zero problem with him. In fact, who wouldn’t feel bad for the guy, y’know?
Of course. Please go on, Gary.
The friction began on the day of the show when Luke was told that Joey and Scott would be going over. He didn’t like that. He complained that the company he was working for at the time – FCW – was going to be pushing he and Cholo as a major tag team and that it would look bad if they lost a match prior to this push. Apparently Anthony had told him that they would originally be going over. However, when I found out about that on the day of the show, I reiterated to Anthony that since Luke was only going to be here once (again, since he was booked as a favor to help him out financially), it made no sense to put he and Cholo over a team that we would probably be using again and again. After making my case, Anthony agreed. As I said before, Luke wasn’t happy about that. After the match, Luke stormed to the back and threw a 100% bonafide tantrum about Scott cutting off his offense and not giving him a chance to “look strong” out there. I stepped in to find out what had happened and got both sides of the story. Scott contended that Luke’s hope spots were getting no reaction, so they simply moved into the next sequence. I agreed 100% with Scott’s take on it and thought Luke was being nothing more than a big baby. Luke accused me of deliberately sabotaging him to make my friends (Joey and Scott) look good, at his expense. A few days after the show, I talked to him on the phone and told him that if he really believed that Scott was trying to sabotage him, I would be more than happy to give he and Scott a match at a future show and they could do whatever they saw fit to tear the house down. I never heard from him again, except for the few whispers and moans that would get back to me from others about how I deliberately sabotaged his career. By the way, I’ve not let my low opinion of Luke in any way effect my opinion of Cholo. In fact, I have more respect for Cholo nowadays than I ever have before.
So, was this event specific to WAR, or did Luke stir up any other problems elsewhere?
Interesting side note, Anthony was a huge Luke supporter until he got word from a particular wrestler about how much of a snitch Luke was at the WSX tapings. I’m not going to name names, but I guess the MTV execs were pretty adamant about the boys laying off the weed during the WSX tapings and good ol’ Luke was only too happy to play Hall Monitor when that particular rule was broken by a handful of 420 supporters. Needless to say, he became the person to avoid at all costs after that.
I would say so. Any more feelings on Luke?
Oh, and I need to stress that he is NOT GAY! Luke is 100% all man and proudly declares it to the world! He HATES ‘fags’ and really wants EVERYONE to know that he is NOT GAY! Got it? Not only is he NOT GAY, but he has NEVER done ANYTHING gay to advance his career and would NEVER, EVER even CONSIDER such an act! So don’t ask. I mean it. It won’t work. He’s 100% ALL MAN!
[Editor’s Note: Warrior Warrior/Luke Hawx for ’08? Make it happen, America .]
From booking world-known talent to booking people that probably aren’t even known in SoCal, which do you prefer: the lesser-known talent or the attention-getters, and why?
I’ll always prefer the lesser known talent slightly more than the fly-ins. The simple reason is because I’m the kind of person who always roots for the underdog. That being said, it’s hard to get attention for your show on a national level without having names on the card. A really good example of this logic working successfully is the review you gave the WAR: Spirit Journey Formation Anniversary DVD, where on a card that featured Low Ki, Austin Aries, Super Dragon, Jack Evans, El Generico and Kevin Steen, the match that really stole the show was the OPENER, of all things, that featured Charles Mercury vs. Markus Riot. How cool is that? Ideally, though, you have to combine locals and fly-ins for maximum show effect. The only negative in all of this is when the name talent doesn’t give 100%.
[Editor’s Note: As Gary stated, I’m a wrestling reviewer. Hopefully I’m an effective interviewer. I won’t plug myself or my website, though, because this interview really is all about Gary . And me leeching off his fame. But whatever.]
Low Ki is pretty notorious on the internet for refusing to job. Did you ever have any problems with that?
Low Ki is one of the most professional people I’ve met in this business. Not only did I never have a problem with him, we once spent 4 hours talking after a show. He was insightful, articulate and a true pleasure to be around.
What’s it like to work with Jack Evans? Does he run around spouting gangsta lingo? Does he enter every room with a Phoenix 450 Somersault Double Splash?
Jack is the real Human Tornado, no disrespect to his ebony-skinned counterpart. He’s simply a whirlwind to be around. The very first day Anthony and I picked him up for the first WAR show, he couldn’t walk from the gate to the parking lot without doing cartwheels and flips. I’m NOT kidding. Even then, I wished we’d had a camera on him. My kids completely love him. Where most adults get worn out by kids and their high energy levels, he actually wears them out, which simply astounds me.
Is Super Dragon truly the baddest motherfucker on the planet?
Let me just say this. There is no other wrestler whom I admire more, professionally and personally. I could go on and on extolling the virtues of Super Dragon but every time I do, Anthony rolls his eyes and starts in with the gay jokes, as if HE’S one to talk with the way he fawns all over Jack.
[Editor’s Note: Eh, I can’t even touch this one. Despite all the comments this is just begging for, I too would worship the ground Super Dragon walked on if I ever met him.]
Would New Jack stab you if you pissed him off enough?
Although my kneejerk reaction is to say, “Not at all,” I’m sure there are a few guys out there who would take umbrage with that statement. In my experience, however, New Jack – while DEFINITELY opinionated and somewhat difficult at times – was always professional WITH ME. The reason I think that it’s important to say that is because I can think of a few situations where he should’ve – by all rights – hurt someone while working for me, BUT DIDN’T.
In that regard, does any “incident” specifically come to mind?
The one instance that comes to mind is at the 2002 EPIC: For the Messiah show. He was scheduled to face a local worker by the name of Black Metal. Black Metal is a pretty big Luchador in SoCal (and by big I mean tall, not well-known) and, like most Luchadors, he’s masked. Now Jack is a big proponent of busting suckas’ heads open and, when you’re masked, that’s kinda hard to do. Black Metal made it clear that he wasn’t going to unmask at the show, nor would he allow New Jack to unmask him and – in his words – “disrespect his tradition.” He said that if New Jack wanted blood for the match, he would be more than happy to let his arm get cut up, but that was it. So Black Metal goes out for the match and he and Aaron Aguilera are cutting a promo together. New Jack is waiting backstage with me, prepping to go out. Jack then looks at me and says, ” Gary, you know I’m getting that mask off, right?” and before I can say anything, his music hits and he’s gone.
Well, Jack proceeds to shoot on Black Metal and – despite Metal’s numerous attempts to prevent him from doing so – winds up unmasking him. However, Jack also proceeds to give Black Metal every opportunity to look strong for the crowd, despite Metal legitimately fighting him tooth and nail with one hand (while using the other hand to desperately keep his mask on) during the entire match. If you get the chance to, go back, watch that match, and LISTEN for all of the audibles called during the bout. That match was a perfect example of – had Jack been in a foul mood – a situation that could have gotten very ugly very quickly. It didn’t, though. As much as Metal cried after the match about me (and doesn’t this sound familiar?) sabotaging his career and disrespecting his tradition, Jack went up to him after the match and explained why he did everything that he did. To the best of my knowledge, they squashed it. He’s still mad at me, though. Go figure.
What the hell is up with Teddy Hart?
Teddy Hart? He crazy. That one’s for you, Kevin. Seriously, Teddy is completely insane, but not in a bad way. He is unpredictable, unstable, and that’s what I loved about working with him. You hire Teddy to be Teddy, and believe me…we got Teddy! I mean C’MON, MAN! Who else can go on for hours about how he’s also working for the CIA training dragons? The sad thing is that you think I’m making that story up.
[Editor’s Note: Shortly after reading this, I tried long and hard to make a joke about Teddy Hart training dragons for the C.I.A. I really, really did. But nothing is coming to mind. That’s just too perfect a visual to even joke about.]
How cut-throat are the SoCal fans, and for that matter – SoCal in general?
In my opinion, when a worker comes to SoCal, he should be prepared to lace his boots up and work because SoCal crowds can be tough. If they even sense that you’re mailing it in, forget about it. They’ll crucify you. Don’t get me wrong. It doesn’t all have to be 5-star work-rate matches to get over. People here like to be entertained, too. But even the entertainment better be work-rate and, quite frankly, if you don’t get what I mean by that … well … I’m tired.
Do you like or hate the Internet Wrestling Community?
I’m going to reprint something from a Super Dragon interview a while back that I feel perfectly captures what I feel about the Internet Wrestling Community. Again, these are Super Dragon’s words –
“Well, I can’t say I hate Internet fans, although I kind of do hate some of them. There is one type of person I especially hate on message boards. The ones that really go out of there way for no reason to talk shit on someone, or make someone look bad for no reason. Those are the fans that make me hate wrestling. I try not to read message boards as much anymore. It’s frustrating to see people saying negatives things when you put so much effort into what you do. It used to bother me a lot more when I was coming up in wrestling and really wanted to impress people. I only read them now to see what people’s opinions are on certain stuff relating to PWG and the shows we do. It helps me see what works and what doesn’t work, even if I disagree with it or not. I know a lot of young wrestlers really get emotional over what people say online. I used to as well. It’s only natural to get upset when you have such a passion for something, and to see someone trash you like it’s nothing. These posters have no idea how they affect wrestlers. Like I said. I don’t really care what anyone has to say about me as a wrestler anymore, good or bad. I got an x-box 360 today, and it was sold out everywhere, so I consider myself to be in the top 17 people on the planet. Anyone that disagrees with that is obviously an idiot, and they should eat their own face. Even if someone doesn’t like something, they don’t have to drive it into your head every time they put their ugly fat fingers on a keyboard. I understand that not everyone has the same taste, but sometimes people are just assholes. That’s my job. Stop trying to make me look bad. I am asshole of the year. Don’t try to contend with that. I know, I really seem like I hate all the net fans. It’s not true though. I love every internet fan that buys our DVD’s. No, seriously. Give me your address, I want to send a Christmas card. Any fan who supports PWG or indy wrestling is okay in my book.”
C’mon, man. How does anyone NOT love that guy?
What would you add to those words?
If I can add one thing, though. You know what else is jacked? When people are nice and respectful to you at shows, but then turn around and talk a buncha shit behind your back. THAT really annoys the shit outta me. However, to be fair, it’s not a wrestling thing as much as it’s just a people thing. Let’s face it, that happens EVERYWHERE in EVERY profession.
What would you like to say about your fellow SoCal wrestling promoters?
Pay your workers. Stop bootlegging everyone else’s DVDs – mine included – all the while bitching about people bootlegging your shit. Stop putting wrestlers in the uncomfortable position of choosing which fed to work for. It’s not like any of you pay anything worth a damn. Who are you to demand that anyone be exclusive to you? Yeah, yeah, I know. You’re gonna make them a TV star. I get it. Puh-leeeeze. Unless you’re Vince, TV as a medium to get the word out about pro wrestling is officially dead and ANYONE trying to pursue that venture may as well be searching for the Fountain of Youth.
Last year TIME magazine voted the YouTube/online revolution as the ‘Person of the Year’ and if anyone doesn’t see where all of this is headed, they’re going to get left – as the old saying goes – in the rear with the gear. Look at the leaps and bounds we’ve made in the last year ALONE when it comes to viewing … well .. ANYTHING. Major networks are airing their shows online. Missed last week’s episode of Lost? Go to CBS.com and you can view the entire season thus far. Miss an episode of Raw? Smackdown? ECW? TNA? Hell, wanna check out a $30-50 PPV without paying a dime? Go to DailyMotion.com the night after the show. I was able to watch the entire last season of House via DailyMotion and the Apprentice on NBC.com. It’s ALL available NOW if you know where to look. Five years from now, our TVs and our computers will be one unit and anything worth checking out will be available online, if – as I said before – it isn’t already.
And now the question that everyone must be waiting for – what’s this about a comeback?
Last year, I was taping shows and putting out DVDs for a company called Battleground Pro Wrestling (aka Big Pro Wrestling). They ran in a small venue in Newhall, California . It’s actually the same building that Henry Luna’s old Golden State Championship Wrestling promotion ran in back in 2002/2003. Anyway, long story short, the owner(s) of Big Pro pulled the plug on the promotion earlier this year and, quite frankly, I’m still not 100% sure why (although I have my guesses, which I won’t go into here). Though the venue IS small, it still attracted a pretty rabid crowd of GENUINE wrestling fans, and by wrestling fans I mean people who wanna get drunk and see people beat the crap outta each other. We’re not talking about a smarky crowd here that rated every match using the star system.
[Editor’s Note: As a reviewer, those words hurt. Negative eighteen stars for that comment, Mr. Yap]
We’re talking about good ol’ fashioned traditional crowds that boo the heel and cheer the face because … well … that’s what they’re supposed to do. It was actually pretty refreshing to see in this day and age of 30+ minute Japanese strong-style stiff-fests.
So, it all started (or re-started, to be exact) when Big Pro closed earlier this year. What next?
When Big Pro closed up shop and the venue became free, I casually tossed an offer to the venue that if they wanted to continue hosting pro wrestling there, to gimme a call. I don’t think that I honestly expected a reply. Yes, I knew that Anthony wanted to run again and yes, even the WAR DVDs had actually started to sell once word started circulating about them (thank you, Oliver). But still. I think it was one of those things that you just kinda keep in the back of your thoughts, not really giving it any more attention than it needs.
Low and behold, about two months later I get a phone call from the venue, asking if I wanted to put on wrestling shows again by taking over the remaining dates that Big Pro had reserved for the rest of 2007. My initial reaction was, “Hell, NO!” I have a really good life right now, without having to worry about the day-to-day bullshit of running a wrestling promotion. There was no WAY I was jumping back into that sea of crap! Anthony worked on me, though, by pitching me a slew of alternative ideas. He agreed that it was a sucker’s bet to attempt to recreate what we did with both EPIC and WAR. What if we tried something completely different, though? Something that was unique and unlike ANYTHING being done in SoCal?
Now that’s a lofty goal. How did you plan to fulfill it?
Big Pro had repeatedly drawn sold-out shows using no fly-ins or names. While the product wasn’t really my cup of tea, there was no denying that there WAS an audience there. In fact, the fed had been slowly losing its’ fanbase over time because it was gradually turning into a family-friendly fed, which I thought was a mistake. The venue is a bar, ferchrissakes, and the people who showed up there wanted to yell, scream, and get rowdy! They wanna see blood, tits, and violence!
[Editor’s Note: As asked before, who doesn’t love titties?]
For the past year and a half, I was also learning about DVD production and – while doing so – I found myself doing something that I never thought I would do again: I started to develop and nurture friendships within the business. EPIC had numbed me when it came to feeling close to people, especially after all that had gone down between me and those whom I truly loved. With WAR, although I had my share of good times, I remained distant and unattached. After all, it wasn’t MY fed. Yes, that’s a cop out answer, but it still doesn’t make it untrue. Remember how I said that working with feds like WPW changed how I saw the business? This was a perfect example of that. I became close to guys like Lil’ Cholo, Infernal, and the rest of the WPW crew, along with folks from feds like UEW and even Big Pro. I saw who treated me politely and respectfully, even when I didn’t have a fed to offer them; who genuinely talked to me and let me in to their lives. A lot of these guys were either wrestlers who weren’t considered the most popular or coolest people in SoCal or wrestlers who were newer to the scene, had all the potential in the world, but didn’t have a place to really show what they could do if REALLY given a chance to shine.
So I did my math. Venue + hot crowds + workers wanting to simply prove themselves to a wider audience = something that actually might work. Hmmm …
And so we’ve got a rebirth on our hands. How’s it all going down?
Anthony and I set up a series of rules, which I will NOT go into here – HA! What I can say, though, was that we would approach EVERYTHING differently than before. To ensure that we would BOTH take a complete and total 50/50 stance on everything, we decided to merge both of our feds, from EPIC Pro Wrestling and Pro Wrestling WAR to EPIC Pro Wrestling WAR. Tact was not one of our strongpoints, but y’know what? I still like it. Adding the EPIC name to his promotion gives me more of a vested interest in this venture succeeding. I can’t just walk away now.
Our mission statement is very simple. EVERY Indy fed out there seems like it wants to take over the world, sometimes literally. Everyone’s trying to be Pirates of the Caribbean or Spider-Man or the Transformers. Us? We don’t want ANY of that. Let ’em have it. We simply wanna sit in our corner and shoot our little black and white Clerks film. You can have your $300,000,000 budgets and A-list actors. We’re happy casting our friends, family members, and just having fun in our little corner of the world. Simple as that. We’re gonna have fun and try to put together something that nobody else is offering this business at this point in time. I guess you’ll just have to see what I’m talking about. No, it won’t be for everyone. And that’s fine, too. Let’s face it. If it were just like everyone else, why do it?
Why indeed. Now, who’s going to handle what in this newly-formed EPWW?
Look, those who say that I’m a shitty wrestling promoter are 100% correct! I am NOT a wrestling promoter. Let me repeat that. I am NOT a wrestling promoter. I am NOT a wrestling promoter, I am NOT a wrestling promoter, I am NOT a wrestling promoter, nor do I EVER aspire to be one! I’m just a goofy guy who draws stuff for a living, shoots cheap B-fims, and makes whacky wrestling DVDs that people seem to enjoy. The EPIC WAR shows are simply one more piece of the puzzle that is my own little slice of the world called Art Over Life Studios, where I get to write what I want, draw what I want, shoot what I want, and when all is said and done – hopefully entertain some people during this rollercoaster ride called life. If this is how the rest of my life plays out, I couldn’t be happier.
Any last words, Gary?
I would like to thank EVERYONE whom I’ve ever met in the history of my life! Those who supported me, encouraged me to go far. Those who doubted me, encouraged me to go farther. More than anyone else, though, I need to thank my Ramee – a woman who is not only my soul mate, lover, and best friend in the entire universe, but my hero, as well. Words will NEVER be able to adequately describe my love for her.
I also wanna give a special thanks to the man who pushed me to do this interview – Oliver. When we started this thing, it was supposed to be something that spanned the course of three or four days. Now, almost three MONTHS later, I look back and can’t believe I got alla that outta my system (not that there ISN’T more to get out – HA!). Your patience during this ENTIRE ordeal is SO APPRECIATED! Oh yeah, and go to www.artoverlifestudios.com and buy stuff! That’s all.
Section 5
Closing Thoughts by the Interviewer
Well… months later, dozens of e-mails and IM’s exchanged, and so many semi-pranks, silent pleadings, and all-around bitching that I felt I’d forever loose the friendship of this unique individual…and the interview with Gary Yap has now been completed. There’s not much to say that hasn’t already been said, folks. I could go on and on describing who I am, how I met Gary , and why he chose me to do the interview- but in the end, it’s all about the man himself.
Who am I? Just a wrestling fan that was lucky enough to make contact with some of the most interesting people I’ve ever met. How did I meet Gary ? Who cares? All I know is that I consider him a friend and will be waiting with baited breath (and money in the wallet, of course) to do my best to support EPIC Pro Wrestling WAR in the only way I really can: snatching up their shows and giving my honest feedback on them. Why did Gary choose me to do this interview? The hell if I know. Before I met him, I was just another random fan that liked reviewing wrestling shows because it combined two of his favorite hobbies- writing about what he likes and watching wrestling. I don’t know exactly where this leaves me in the grand scheme of things- is this going to make waves for myself as well as Gary? But, the truth is, I really don’t care how this affects me.
In all honesty, I’m just a regular guy that has been honored and privileged enough to give the SoCal and Internet Wrestling Community a glimpse into the life and times of a truly special individual. For me, I’ve already gotten everything I want out of this interview. I never thought I’d ever make any contact with someone that’s actually inside the wrestling business, much less a two-time owner/promoter/Jack-of-All-Trades with high hopes and a vision that I sincerely hope will take SoCal by storm. But the important thing, at least for me, is that Gary Yap isn’t just a “contact” anymore, he’s not just someone I can point at and say “Look, I know this guy, I’m an insider!!!”. That’s never been the case. The important thing is that Gary Yap isn’t an “insider contact” that I can brag about…he’s a friend that I’m glad to have, and I truly am honored that he would give me an exclusive interview detailing his unique history in this business and profession we all hold so dearly to our hearts.
So, that’s my write up, SoCal faithful/IWC faithful. Hopefully all our readers have enjoyed this little interview as much as Gary and I enjoyed cranking it out. In regards to thanking people, there’s a long list, but I’ll keep it short and to the point. I’d just like to thank Gary and whoever chooses to read this little blurb of ours. I thank Gary for this opportunity, for this insight, for letting me be the vehicle that officially announces the debut of a federation… but most importantly, I thank Gary for being a friend…for being Gary .
As always, I thank the fans (and who am I to talk? I’m a fan myself!) for reading what I have to write. Feedback is always appreciated, and if by some chance you’ve read my works before, you’ll no doubt remember that I say those four little words often. Any comments or questions, feel free to either send them over to Gary (you can find all his contact information at www.artoverlifestudios.com) or myself (pdw2kx@yahoo.com). We’ll be happy to hear from you.
From Gary Yap, from Oliver Saenz / PdW2kX, and especially from all of those that wish to make a difference in the wide world we all know and love as SoCal, we wish you and yours the best. Thank you for reading.
